Game Balance

[silveralen]

Just curious, I'm wanting to see whether the terminators are having as big effect as I think.

Also if everyone else thinks I'm wrong the devs won't have to listen to me whine 

[Joven]

Good start,
judging from my balance experience, we got quite a lot of changes on both teams. I'm very pleased to see the warrior buff, though I'm not sure what this means in the long term. On the one hand, you have really a chance against sm in ranged now. That makes Warriors a little bit more of an all-round assault class, instead a melee class that uses its ranged weaponary just to weaken or finish already heavily injured enemies. On the other hand, I had a lot of problems surving long enough as a tac to get enough points for even t2 classes. I have no predictions nor suggestionson that matter, so I'd say, time will tell.

It's nice to see the vet's chainsword being buffed and used more, though I'm not fully conviced of its usefulness yet. I still prefer plasma with its splash and big projectile size, which makes hits on close enemies guaranteed.

After some rounds playing nids, I have to admit I'm rather shocked that the termi is even more imba then I deemed it to be. While he feels like he's got a higher damage output then heavy, he takes considerably MUCH more damage . I sneaked up on a unwary terminator from behind, landed 3 hits on him only to find me struck by his immense melee dmg, though he didn't even hit the first time. Also his invulnerability to acid damage makes it incredibly difficult to handle him as a warrior, unless you approach them in triplicates.
While I enjoy his ability to kick fex asses, I feel cheated if I can't harm him as a warrior without the element of surprise, the same as Im uncontent about not being able to backstab him as a lictor.
I'd recommand to lower either his survivability or his melee dmg output drastically. Even for a T3 class he feels too powerful. The Storm bolter however looks fine.

Can't tell you anything founded about the trope yet, I didn't come to play him often until now. Actually it's a little bit early for me to discuss balance, it takes me a while to realize the problems and find possible solutions...

[silveralen]

yeah, it is early, I just figured since besides the devs and a few others people don't use this all that much, putting it up as soon as possible seemed wise.

The one good thng about termi is he gives space marines a class that can actually push up in confined areas, like some bits of hive which were all but impassable before. Also, warriors should be having their asses handed to them by a termi, 3-4 tacticals often get their asses handed to them by a carni, and he is just a tier 2. I assumed by in triplicate you meant you needed 3 warriors to really hurt a terminator btw. Also remember Tyranids have Genestealers coming, and witht he ambush potential and speed they should be better tier 1 the warriors.

Thrope is still meh, though a little less meh, but I'll still take a carni 9/10 times. Same with veteran, never found a compelling reason to use it instead of specialist.

Tyranids need a tier 3 class I'd say, so after genestealers I'll bet that'll be in the works.

[ChromeAngel]

It's a bit early to judge balance yet.  I generally like a week or so of game-play to shake down the existing players.  It gives them time to adjust their tactics to the new conditions..

Given the outcome of the last poll I think we're more likely to see medics before a carnifex with a ranged weapon.

[silveralen]

I know it's early, people can change their vote (I think I left that option on) so it is just to get votes of people who only come on the forums once every week or two.

Also I'd never heard of one of the (I guess) newer Tyranids the Trygon. Personally I think it'd make an interesting tier 3. Or Tyranid guards, the newer modles for them are very cool. I can actually do some modeling, so if that's the main reason your considering another carnifex with improved ranged weapons I could help.

[Joven]

Fex are T2, right, but Nids need that bulky tank to stand against the ranged weapons of marines. They force marines to focus him instead of his fragile brothers, and that makes up for the power level of the nid T2 classes and the lack of proper ranged combat.
If it's fair to include a tanky marine unit that makes up for that handycap, nids should have a VERY powerful ranged unit too to balance things out, let's say at the same power level as the heavy.
Besides, you disregard one thing completely : Tacs can take cover and run away from the fex while shooting, warriors can't do any significant harm to the termi outside of their action range (meaning the range were termi weapons become important), the first warrior approaching the terminator rarely deals any damage to the heavy.
I know well about those Genestealers. But no one knows when that is going to happen and we should opt for a game that is balanced in the present, not a game that needs a future class X to be balanced, if you get what I mean.

Specialist/Vet is a personal thing, really. I like both of them, though I prefer Vet for the fast movement speed and wide weapon arsenal that covers mostly all wishes.

[silveralen]

Fex are T2, right, but Nids need that bulky tank to stand against the ranged weapons of marines. They force marines to focus him instead of his fragile brothers, and that makes up for the power level of the nid T2 classes and the lack of proper ranged combat.

You do realize Marines are at a huge disadvantage in cc ranges? For instance, the blue console in Hive is very hard for a Marine team to cap, because their are 3-4 blind corners and 2 places where nids can drop right on their heads. A terminator in front, with his tankieness, forces the nids to attack him while the other marines focus their fire on them, much as a Carnifex forces marines to fire at him ignoring the Tyranid Warriors. It is the same idea.

In short, if Tyranid gets a class which allows them to semi nullify the range advantages of the Marines, ie the Carnifex, then it is perfectly reasonable for marines to also have a tank class which stalls Tyranids and allows them to remain in ranged combat longer. If Tyranids stand a chance moving in from long range, Space Marines get a chance in short cc ranges.