Mode Discussion - Genestealer Cult War

[ChromeAngel]

One of the four game modes shortlisted, by the team for Exterminatus - Rival Species 2 (a one week poll to settle this subject will start on January the seventh).

Genestealer Cult War

++Full Mode Description++

This is the wacky, pushing the envelope of the "tyranid setting" mode of the four shortlisted.  Based in a sub-setting of the 40k universe that has faded into obscurity since it's hayday during the 2nd edition...

Years ahead of the attack of a hive fleet proper Genestealers (stealters) infiltrate the victim galaxy, to weaken it's defenses.  By implanting their genes and sublte mind-control stealers establish "broods" or "cults", composed of stealer hybrids and their families.  When the time is ripe the cult raises up in rebellion to the infected civilization bringing destruction from within as the hivefleet attacks from without.

Cult could form a good starting point for a "Space Hulk" mode in a later release.

Questions?  Suggestions?

[Egarb]

I think it would be interesting if instead of an all out fight it was more sneaky.

2 teams divided 2/3rds imperial 1/3rd cultists.

the map is an urban town with AI citiizens walking around. The genestealers objective is to infect civilians while remaining undetected. When an AI civilian is infected, the infector has the option of having it follow and defend him, sending it away (off the map, presumably to the cult hideout) and having it count towards the cults score, or havind go about its buisness to be called on later. If an Imperial player is infected, he defects to the cults side, infecting a player should require much sneakiness.

The Imperials would be tasked with rooting out the cultists, they would most likely be PDF (just guardsmen essentially) with one or two higher ups leading the group (a space marine or two, maybe an inquisitor, or maybe a particularly tough PDF agent(an ogryn for example)). They could inspect the AI citizens for infection (who upon discovery would turn hostile), and hunt down the PC cultists. Alternatively all the Imperial PCs could be Heroic types with a bunch of wimpy PDF in tow.

The gameplay would sort of be like "The Hidden" and "The Ship" combined.

The PDF and Infected should be weak, the Cultists should be stronger than the PDF (not much) and much faster, show visible signs of genestealer mutations, but have limited access to weapons, and perhaps have a little telepathic power (convince a citizen to walk towards him from a distance, into a dark alley or some such)

The heroic imperials would be the strongest thing on the map, and have access to all weapons.

Hmmm it appears i just described the FPS ive always wanted.... oh well im sure someone will like it.

PS dont forget to include the genestealer limo

[migb]

(Everithing I say here is a comment to the game mode suggested by Egarb)
This sounds pretty much as an Inquisitor game, with stealth, mutants and suble goals.    
One problem with this setting is that the Imperial Inquisition or Guard will be called for on such a small-scale war. Unless it's on Ultamar itself, of cause. We could have a very respected inquistioner taking command of a band of Ultramarines to root out the alien infestation.
I would really, really love an inquisitor-style game, but this would be somewhat different from the role we normally see the Ultramarines in (as super-elite storm-troopers).
The SM will have a difficould choise: Stay together, and risk stealers sneaking around them, compleating their infiltration in secret, or spread out, risking to get overwhelmed one by one...  :twisted:

[Egarb]

I think youre right about the whole "wtf are Ultramarines doing fighting a cult" it really isnt even a job for imperial guard, PDF would do it. So my idea wouldnt be feasable for the RS2 team unless they're already modeling a Imp. Guard for some reason (which could be easily reskinned to look like PDF troops, PDF are almost the same as guard anyway, just with worse equipment).

Of course i dont think it would make sense for genestealers to be fighting all out with ultramarines in any situation, except of course space hulk, perhaps space hulk is the best idea, since you could use models already being created, perhaps a space hulk type synapse could be in the first release with the culty synapse being added in later (assuming that the team has enough time, and that the mod is popular enough).

[blackt]

im not so deep in the fluff but wouldnt the ordo xenos inspecting if the think there could be the danger of xenos infection?

[Typheron]

Well you see heres the thing, 'stealer cults have genestealers in them and they have a Patriarch Stealer at their heart which is a highly psykik stealer as well as all the hybrids and clan troops.

Now the IG or PDF would deal with the open rebels, But they aint gonna be able to handle going into the cults home base as its gonna be crawling with Stealers and no amount of IG can realistically deal with that.

So thats where space marines come in. They have the training and the gear to do it.

[Egarb]

Actually, usually the PDF would be on their own, the cult would most likely spring up quickly and remain undetected for some time, usually masquerading as a sort of nondenominational group of Emporer worshipers, (IE they to the Imperium look like a legitimate cult, instead of a Xenos cult I can drag up a bit of fluff that supports this if you want). By the time the local PDF got wind, the cult could be of fairly substantial size, the planet could be overrun by the time the Guard or Inquisitors got there. Oftentimes the Guard would arrive to find that the Planet had been almost wholly infected (warranting Externinatus), or that the PDF had for the most part beaten back the cult. That or the cult and PDF are in an all out war (with of course a hivefleet on the way).

So definitely a job for the PDF, the Patriarch definitely wouldn't usually openly fight, but instead flee to preserve the cult (even though he has substantial fighting abilities). So when the PDF (or Guard if they've gotten there, interstellar travel can take quite some time) encounter him, it would be him on the run with his elite guard. If the PDF is well equipped (unlikely, depending on the importance of the planet, or its manufacturing capabilities) or has superior numbers, they should be able to take oout the patriarch (albeit with a good deal of "acceptable losses").

So the possible settings for "Genestealer Cult War" are:

1) Marines arrive to a heavily infested planet, backed up only by the few remaining PDF

2) Marines arrive with the planet in all out civil war

3) PDF fighting in all out civil war, no marine support (possibly en route)

4) PDF catch wind early, have support of Imperial Guard, due to their relative close positioning

5) PDF catch wind early, no Imperial support (possibly en route)

6) PDF/support (or only PDF) chasing down an on the run patriarch


Now that I mention it option 6 seems like another good gameplay idea, Marines chasing down the patriarch and his hevily mutated, heavily armed elite guards. A sort of reverse VIP escort where the Patriarch must reach the map edge.

Anyway, sorta geeked out there and typed more than I meant to, why do i know this much about genestealers. Meh. If my ideas flop I can at least quote fluff for yall.

Edited for spelling, I'm a third generation firstborn son of an engineer, engineers are notoriously bad spellers

[ChromeAngel]

I had in mind a state shading between Egarb's settings 1 and 2.  The marines arriving in the late stages of a civil war thet the cult is winning (having sucessfuly infiltaited and divided the PDF early on).

Setting 6 could be a sub-objective withing the mission structure rather than a mode all on it's own.

[migb]

But Edgarb, why are the Ordo Xenos missing in all of your scenarios?
It's after all their job to collect any evidence of possibly xenos-related activity. They would VERY OFTEN discover the cult before the planear defence forces, but perhaps comandeer some PDF troops to back them up in the fighting.

By the way Edgarb, you seem like a very active discusser. Why don't you come around at the IRC channel (quakenet, #rspecies2), there are as much activity there as in the forum.

[ChromeAngel]

Rememebr that OX are a small fraction of the space marines and that there is less than one space marine per inhabited world.  Keep this in mind and you will see the monumental task they face.

With an imperium if a million inhabited worlds even if the imperial agencies catch 99.99% of all alien infiltrations (I doubt it...) before they become a danger a hundred worlds are still endagered.  Within that shadow of those dark places, beyond the emporer's light, that spawns the Cult War.

 :twisted:

[Wolf]

i didnt see it before but this mode cud be quite good ^^

[migb]

Rememebr that OX are a small fraction of the space marines

I remember OX to be a part of the Inquisition, an imperial organisation relatet to neither IG, SM or the Ecclisary, but with the power to commandeer almost any member of those other organisations.

[Razielk]

the space marines in the OX deathwatch are made up from volenteers from any chapter, they serve for however long they like before going back to their chapters, but i think they can commandeer anything else

[migb]

Ever read the Eisenhart novels?
I was actually thinking about someone like him.
An Inquistioner, moving quickly between worlds, following every rumor indicating xenos infiltration, then striking quickly at the cults with his personal guard of followers and merchenaries. A SM or two may be assigned to his command for a time, if the chapter can spare the warrior and trust the Inquistioner.

[Egarb]

MigB you mean the "Eisenhorn" novels  

The reason I never mention the Ordo Xenos is that I don't see them usually getting mixed up in genestealer wars, even thought it falls directly udnder their jusrisdiction. This isn't for lack of want. Unless an Inquisitor was just sauntering around a planet with a new cult the Ordo Xenos wouldnt know until it was too late for them to do it, and heres my reasoning.

Usually the PDF would find out about the cult first, and would call for help, and begin fighting.  Taking into account the lenngth of time it takes for space travel, (even warp travel takes a god while, unless the reinforcement are stationed in the next solar system) it may be months or even years before ANYONE comes to aid them.  By that time the PDF either have it under control, are in a stalemate, or are being overrun. In any event, an Inquisitor and his personal retuine (as mighty as they may be) wont be what is needed. Either nothing would be needed, or an army is needed. What is an Inquisitor gonna do against a flood of genestealers? Pop a few and say "Damn! I'm not prepared for this.... Exterminatus."

I always saw Ordo Xenos dealing with more longterm alien threats, Tau incursions into Imperial space, roumors of an Ork fleet, Chaosy cults, etc.

As to why I dont join the IRC.... Thats a good question, I'll get on that withing the week.